Duck and Cover Forum Index


Use these links, buy stuff from Amazon and help us out, nubs.
Amazon.com | Amazon.ca | Amazon.co.uk | Amazon.de
  Duck and Cover  •  FAQ  •  Search  •  Memberlist  •  Usergroups   •  Register  •  Profile  •  Log in to check your private messages  •  Log in

 Support DAC!
 Tilesets and how to use them... View next topic
View previous topic
Post new topicReply to topic
Author Message
Red
Hero of the Glowing Lands
Hero of the Glowing Lands


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 2085
Location: Nowhere (important anyway)

PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2002 6:25 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Well, this isn't how to use them - YET.

I sent a reahter lengthy email to Odin from NMA about how to use Tilesets. If/Once he finds it and sends it back to me, I'll make sure to post it, as using TileSets can GREATLY enhance the look of your map without a lot of trouble (counting you don't think creating the tileset too much trouble).

Basically they allow you to create "randomness" which is MUCH better then anything you could try to emulate by hand. And I'm dead serious that a map created using them will look just amazing compared to a map without... And I want everyone to use them smile So a new thread will soon follow with the article soon.

I'm sorry I don't write something up right now, but I'm hoping someone else could post something while I'm waiting since I don't have time to re-write it right now.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM AddressYahoo MessengerMSN MessengerICQ Number
ThS204
SDF!
SDF!


Joined: 01 Jun 2002
Posts: 5
Location: Califoo'rnia

PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2002 11:03 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Isnt that just the same as Shift+"select tiles"? Thats what I always use it works just fine in making it look random.

icon_confused2: icon_confused2: icon_confused2:
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's website
Flamescreen
Vault Hero
Vault Hero


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 1017
Location: Stone of Light Land

PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2002 11:41 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Not exactly, using shift + tiles technique is rather entirely random, which can sometimes have not desired results, whereas saving a group of tiles and then load-copying gives you much more control while still retaining the randomness effect. I was told by Endocore that the forrest in "Quagmire" was built this way, which is absolutely beautifull to see, to give an example...
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's website
OnTheBounce
TANSTAAFL
TANSTAAFL


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 2257
Location: Grafenwoehr, Oberpfalz, Bayern, Deutschland

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 3:58 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Red, please include instructions on how to get Tile Sets working properly along with this, please. I'm running Win ME, so that quoting batch file doesn't work for me. I can't remember exactly what it is that needs to be done to set up the Tile Sets so that they work properly. icon_sad

OTB
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
War Bringer
Vault Dweller
Vault Dweller


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 150
Location: Eden Facility 3 Project: Sigma (Testing) In.The.Center.Of.The.Storm

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 4:17 am Reply with quoteBack to top

pwahahhaahah! YOU BASTARDS! RANDAM EFFECT?! YOU BASTARDS!!AND TO THINK ALL THIS TIME I WAS PLACING THEM 1 AT A TIME!
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Max-Violence
Wandering Hero
Wandering Hero


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 1221
Location: In my own personal vault

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 5:07 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Ditto on OTB's situation.

War Bringer: Get off the computer and go take a nap.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's website
OnTheBounce
TANSTAAFL
TANSTAAFL


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 2257
Location: Grafenwoehr, Oberpfalz, Bayern, Deutschland

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 10:16 am Reply with quoteBack to top

War Bringer wrote:
pwahahhaahah! YOU BASTARDS! RANDAM EFFECT?! YOU BASTARDS!!AND TO THINK ALL THIS TIME I WAS PLACING THEM 1 AT A TIME!


Yes, but I have to say that from what I've seen your maps look really good.

Max-Violence wrote:
War Bringer: Get off the computer and go take a nap.


Yes Warbringer, it's naptime. If you resist, we'll give a tranquilizer...rectally... :twisted:

OTB
View user's profileSend private messageVisit poster's website
Red
Hero of the Glowing Lands
Hero of the Glowing Lands


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 2085
Location: Nowhere (important anyway)

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 10:32 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Basically you need to doublequote all the lines in the tileset, except the first line (SavedTileSetV1 I beleive).

Also note that to save a tileset, you need a tileset directory to be created.... I'm affraid I don't rememeber where it is/should be located however, and my best guess would be core/tilesets.

Here's a regexp to convert it:
Code:
s/^(.*)$/"\1"/
Now I'm guessing most of you don't know what is or how to use a regexp, so I'll include an easy way to use it.
  • Donwload UltraEdit (There are plenty of other which editors support this, but this is beyond the scope of this post) and install it
  • Go into the Advanced -> Configuration menu, Select the Find tab, and check the Unix Style Regular Expressions checkbox.
  • Once that's done, open the *.tse tileset file, do a Search -> Replace (Ctrl-R), make sure that the Regular Expressions checkbox is in fact checked and type
    Code:
    ^(.*)
    in the Find What text area, and
    Code:
    "\1"
    in the Replace With text area. (Note that this will all be remembered by the program unles syou change it, so you'll no longer need to do all this again. Same goes for the configuration of course.)
  • Press Start and you're mostly done!
  • Make sure to remove the quotes from the first line.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM AddressYahoo MessengerMSN MessengerICQ Number
endocore
Regular
Regular


Joined: 21 Apr 2002
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 11:14 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Flamescreen wrote:


I was told by Endocore that the forrest in "Quagmire" was built this way, which is absolutely beautifull to see, to give an example...



Actually I always build maps using the laborious "one tile at a time" method. What I actually meant was that in laying out the forest, for example, in Quagmire, I built (one tile at a time) a forest sample that was an entire map region in size, and then copied and pasted this entire thing to fill in the rest of the surface area that was forested. The river was constructed using the same method. I have used this process in all my maps, but in the past a few folks had commented that some of the tile placements were distractingly repetitive since I copied and repeatedly pasted much smaller sample areas, and my hope (apparently it worked) was that by using areas that were repetitive but so large that the repetition could not be seen on a single screen snapshot, an illusion of more randomness in tile placement could be created.


I'm quite interested in your topic, Red, since placing tiles is the least enjoyable part of the design process for me and I'm all for anything that might make it less time-consuming. I admittedly don't really know what sort of operation you're referring to, however. Until a "how-to" is forthcoming, what exactly does this process of using "tilesets" accomplish?


Endocore
View user's profileSend private message
Red
Hero of the Glowing Lands
Hero of the Glowing Lands


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 2085
Location: Nowhere (important anyway)

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 11:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Well, I now have time to explain it really... I'll reinstall FO:T... This is quite cumbersome as I have to download three files and fiddle a lot to get it to work (mp demo + "3rd CD fix" + 1.27 patch == what I work with).
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM AddressYahoo MessengerMSN MessengerICQ Number
Max-Violence
Wandering Hero
Wandering Hero


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 1221
Location: In my own personal vault

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 11:49 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Uh, which one of the versions of UltraEdit should we grab? I got the 32-bit version with American English Dictionary file, is that OK? Or do I need some other stuff?

Well, that's as far as I'm gonna go with this stuff for right now... I'm not even sure I understand what a Tile Set is... although I would guess it's a set of tiles...
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailVisit poster's website
Red
Hero of the Glowing Lands
Hero of the Glowing Lands


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 2085
Location: Nowhere (important anyway)

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 12:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

For the purpose of making tiles, it really doesn't matter. 32bit of course, as the 16bit is for win 3.x...
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM AddressYahoo MessengerMSN MessengerICQ Number
Red
Hero of the Glowing Lands
Hero of the Glowing Lands


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 2085
Location: Nowhere (important anyway)

PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2002 12:45 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

endocore wrote:
I built (one tile at a time) a forest sample that was an entire map region in size, and then copied and pasted this entire thing to fill in the rest of the surface area that was forested.
That's what I did at first too... It got generic to look somewhat good. I further "improved" this method by simply mixing around bits and pieces of the "final product" to increase the randomness (ie, I made a "big tile" which is, say, 100x100, paste that in somewhat random locations (not leaving any tiles out), then selected a random 10x10 square and pasted it elsewhere, repeat, rinse). All that still wasn't random enough for me, so I decided to delve into making the tilesets work for me.

One thing I find that's missing in the whole tilset ordeal (other then the 2 missaps: the directory doesn't exist, it doesn't create it and you can't find the .tse files, and that the #$^(*&^$ quotes are missing) is that when loading tiles it would have been really nice to be able to see the first tile in the list, as sometimes names can get quite confusing, specially if you have a lot of them. And them being in a specific directory kinda excludes the whole idea of storing them besiades tiles which are related... (say you'd like to make "random_desert_70pc_sand" (pc for %, where 70% of the time you have normal sand tiles, and 30% you have rocks and other features), you'd intuitivly like to store it beside the sand tiles... sorry, can't do that!)
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM AddressYahoo MessengerMSN MessengerICQ Number
War Bringer
Vault Dweller
Vault Dweller


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 150
Location: Eden Facility 3 Project: Sigma (Testing) In.The.Center.Of.The.Storm

PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2002 7:21 am Reply with quoteBack to top

guys, i'm lost. i've never finished my "big project" just because it got annoying after a while and i was using the 1x1 method of tile placement.

i finally decided to finish it up by using tilesets, but i can't save them or(probably) i don't know what i'm doing. i highlight, click save, and nothing happens. help.

thanks
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Red
Hero of the Glowing Lands
Hero of the Glowing Lands


Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 2085
Location: Nowhere (important anyway)

PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2002 8:52 am Reply with quoteBack to top

First of all... learn about the Grid Res. On the upper right of screen, near the FPS counter, there's a little box labelled "rid res". Type in 6 in there and yey! no longer need to use the 1x1 method...

For telisets, read this thread.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mailAIM AddressYahoo MessengerMSN MessengerICQ Number
War Bringer
Vault Dweller
Vault Dweller


Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 150
Location: Eden Facility 3 Project: Sigma (Testing) In.The.Center.Of.The.Storm

PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2002 4:40 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

i got it to work. just wanted to say thanks.
View user's profileSend private messageSend e-mail
Display posts from previous:      
Post new topicReply to topic


Jump to:  



View next topic
View previous topic
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group