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Shadowvalor
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 5:31 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Kinda how it's done in Fallout/Fallout2, would it be posible to do a multi-map area?
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Jimmyjay86
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 6:09 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Yes it can be done. There is a trigger that says once you get to an exit grid you can go directly to another map. The tricky part is going back and forth between the two. The Tactics engine needs to be told if it is the first time in a map and what you have done last time you are there. So you must make proper use of campaign variables to make sure you don't lose track of things that have happened.
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Jimmyjay86
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 6:20 am Reply with quoteBack to top

This info is from this document which was culled from various Q&A's from the old board. The original document is here:Answers

Is it posible(how?) to link/bound/glue/or_something_like_that two missions in the purpose of achieving a town effect like in FO2... you know what i mean...
Yes, you can link missions together like a FO/FO2 town in FoT. You can use the trigger "Go to mission" rather than the "End Mission: World Map". There is a problem with it, though. Let's say that you're going to do this with three missions. You would have to end the first mission with "Go to Mission 2", the second mission with "Go to Mission 3" and the third mission with "End Mission: World Map". This means that every time you go into that town, you would have to go through all three maps in order to leave. I think you might be able to solve this with switches, but that would be pretty cheesy too, since you'd have to have something (pop-up world text, an NPC "tour guide", etc.) let the player know that he/she could do this.

In order to have the non-entry-level missions not display on world map you simply don't put the triggers in to uncover them. Basically, this is what the three Vault-0 missions do in the core campaign.

Cheers,

OTB


You have a mission; one mission has 4 edges, right? , so you define 4 game-zones right next to those 4 edges (N,S,W,E) now comes the tricky part:
I think you can make it in 2 ways(one of 'em not sure if possible)

(The simpler way - not sure if this is possible) you make those zones IN THE EXITGRID'S "zone" = >

Triggers:

All at exit grid - AND in zone N *action* go to mission 2

All at exit grid - AND in zone S *action* go to mission 3

All at exit grid - AND in zone S *action* go to mission 4

All at exit grid - AND in zone E *action* end mission

Said not sure if possible because I donno if you can put the zone IN the exit grid

The other way … this IS a tricky one

You put the zones right in front of the exit grid 1 tile wide =>

Variable: TOWN_PART_TO_GO_TO

Triggers:

Player in zone N *action* set TOWN_PART_TO_GO_TO = N

Player in zone S *action* set TOWN_PART_TO_GO_TO = S etc

All at exit grid - AND TOWN_PART_TO_GO_TO = = N *action* go to mission 2

All at exit grid - AND TOWN_PART_TO_GO_TO = = S *action* go to mission 3 etc

(Maybe the syntax I have used is not correct but you can see the big picture)

Of course you make this for all 4 missions



Using your idea of zones/grids you could even get as fancy as laying out 9 maps like this:

A B C

D E F

G H I

Using the grids and zones you could have Mission A leading to the World Map, Mission B, Mission D, or even Mission E if you wanted to put a grid on the SE corner...

Don't worry about the syntax. You don't have to write the triggers yourself, you simply select them from menus, although occasionally you have name things, and in that case you just have to make sure that you get the names straight each time you use them. (Yes, they're case-sensitive, too.)

PS If you can think of something regarding dialogue, good luck. Dialogue would make this game every bit put this game in a league above both FO/FO2 and FoT. The only way seems to be to re-write the game engine, though. MF/IP/14° East might have a thing to say about that, though.

Yes, I'm saying your idea of combining the exit grids and zones would work. That is great because it is simple, since setting up zones is as easy as poiting and clicking three times and giving the zone a name. (I'll have to check to see if it is possible to put a "Quantity Unit" trigger in with the "All Alive" qualifier, that way you can't park people in different exit zones and give the game heartburn. *lol*

Cheers,

OTB

I was really enthusiastically starting my Fallout + Fallout 2 mod for FO:T, but I ran into a brick wall after the first few steps - I can't make single player maps that have events that trigger ONLY when I come in first time. In other words, I can't make the game understand when I'm entering the town for the first, and when the second, third, etc. time. Help, anyone?

This is a trigger headache, btw.

What you need is a couple of mission variables that your triggers check. When your mission variables initialize, make a mission variable called "First_Visit_Complete", or something equally informative, and set it to "False". Also, make one more for each of the visits that you want it to affect. (Second_Visit_Complete, etc.)

For your mission ending, you'll need:

Condition: "Bos has all alive at exit grid", and "Mission Variable 'First_Visit_Complete' is 'False'.

Action: "Set mission variable 'First_Visit_Complete' to 'True'", plus any other things like mission debriefing, changing the campaign variable for this mission to complete, etc.

So now you have the triggers recognizing that you've been there once. For you next visit you'd need something like this for your mission ending:

Condition: "BoS has all alive at exit grid", "Mission variable 'First_Visit_Complete' is 'True', "Mission variable 'Second_Visit_Complete' is 'False'

Action: "Set mission variable 'Second_Visit_Complete' to 'True', etc.

Do you get the picture? Also, remember that if you want the number of times you've visited a place to affect other areas make those mission variables campaign variables. Also, make sure that "Nuke Triggers on Exit" isn't ticked for the map(s) you're working with, since this disables all of the triggers when you leave the map.
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Shadowvalor
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 6:51 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Thats perfect! Thanks a bunch.

All we need now is the ability to make new player/NPC animations, and we're set.

Since I don't want to spam, or be accused as such, I have another quick question: Is there a way to make more armor looks than the ones already placed in the engine? Or are those ones defined via hardcode?
(I'm talking about the non, leather, metal, envrio, power, ghoul, supermurtant, raider, reaver, brahmin choice you have when makeing armor. Any more of those, and define the Sprite it chooses.)
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Jimmyjay86
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 7:06 am Reply with quoteBack to top

You are stuck with the armors that you have listed. Of course you can make a different armor for the inventory, but the sprite of the character won't look any different.
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OnTheBounce
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 10:02 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Sorry to disappoint you, Shadowvalor, but I was talking out of my ass on that subject. (That conversation took place last September, IIRC.)

It is not possible to set up a multi-map location like you did in the FO RPGs in FoT. The problem is that when you use the "GoTo Mission" trigger, the AI loads up a fresh version of that mission. So if you're looking to have a series of maps that the player can move back and forth between you out of luck. The only solution to keep the mission from being loaded up w/o changes, is to have the party dumped onto the World Map, which isn't what you're looking for.

However it really isn't necessary to have multi-location maps. The only problem you will encounter is that there are no elevators in FoT. Other than that, you can make multi-level maps to simulate things like Vaults or the Casinos in New Reno, and the maps themselves can be large enough to encorporate an entire FO town/city. So it really isn't necessary.

OTB
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Shadowvalor
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 11:22 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Okay, well thanks for clearing that up.
Beign not such a great mapper, with a slow computer, I can only do my best either way.

By the way, I'm still waiting on that tutorial about new ammo types you mentioned?
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Red
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 11:39 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Just a thought... could you move ("teleport") an entire party and thus emulate an elevator?
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Max-Violence
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 12:33 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Well, that depends on whether or not the game can recognize a trigger in one .mis file that uses a waypoint entity in another .mis file, and I seriously doubt that's the case.

Damn good idea, though...
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Jimmyjay86
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PostPosted: Tue May 28, 2002 8:16 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Red asked:
Quote:
Just a thought... could you move ("teleport") an entire party and thus emulate an elevator?


If you want to transport them from one location on a map to another location on the same map deep underground, the answer is yes. Just give your squad tag names and use the trigger condition "Move Unit". It works very nicely. Oh and just set up a switch in a room you designate as an elevator. There may be a way to choose from several floor options using my revised speech tree method.
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Flamescreen
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 1:21 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Jimmyjay86 wrote:

using my revised speech tree method.


You mean the Yes-No etc., or have you made further progress there?
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Red
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 1:21 am Reply with quoteBack to top

That's interesting... Someone could make a kind of weird fake sprite that's actually (a lot) bigger then it's bounding box and would actually emulate the "top" of the elevator panel, and then add "slices" to this panel (with more sprites) for each level, with the bottom one being another special decorative panel... Hope someone does this smile
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Max-Violence
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 1:52 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Back to Red's original idea (teleporting): There might be a way to do that using campaign variables, but I'm not sure.
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OnTheBounce
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 2:49 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Max-Violence wrote:
Back to Red's original idea (teleporting): There might be a way to do that using campaign variables, but I'm not sure.


I don't see how. You can't use the "Move Unit" trigger between maps, and if you use the "GoTo Mission" trigger you can only move one way, unless you dump people back onto the world map, which isn't an effective solution to simulate an elevator, or another part of a city.

Personally, I'm putting together some maps that are as close to direct copies of FO/FO2 maps as the differences between tilesets and POV allows and I'm very satisified w/the results. The only thing is that I've had to substitute stairwells for elevators. (In some cases I made it look like a broken elevator which had holes punched in the roof/floor to allow for a ladder.) The only other problem I've encountered is trying to simulate usable manhole covers, which are "do-able" due to the lack of a Trapdoor-type entity (not to mention the accompanying sprite).

OTB
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Jimmyjay86
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 3:26 am Reply with quoteBack to top

OTB mentioned
Quote:
The only other problem I've encountered is trying to simulate usable manhole covers


I've used the manhole cover tile and simulated being able to go inside by making it ethereal and climbable which led to my dilemma in the other thread. It is potentially possible to make it into a sprite and some sort of door entity where it slides to the side.

Red pondered
Quote:
That's interesting... Someone could make a kind of weird fake sprite that's actually (a lot) bigger then it's bounding box and would actually emulate the "top" of the elevator panel, and then add "slices" to this panel (with more sprites) for each level, with the bottom one being another special decorative panel...


Yep, instead of the yes or no sprites you can make numbered boxes which can be stacked by the use of waypoints. This can be done to give the effect of the switch panel in Fallout. You can add as many separate slices as you want and just transport people to basement levels of an underground complex without need for stairs. And like OTB mentioned you don't need to transport to another map, there is plenty of space within one map to accomplish this.
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Red
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 3:50 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Of course you'd stay in the same map... the Whole teleportation idea was to stay within the map... Point was to remove the need for stairs...
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Max-Violence
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 5:12 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Red wrote:
Of course you'd stay in the same map... the Whole teleportation idea was to stay within the map... Point was to remove the need for stairs...


Well, in that case, using waypoints and the Move Unit trigger can easily mimic an elevator.

I think I'm just gonna shut the hell up and finish Rebellion2...
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OnTheBounce
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 7:01 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Jimmyjay86 wrote:
[I've used the manhole cover tile and simulated being able to go inside by making it ethereal and climbable which led to my dilemma in the other thread. It is potentially possible to make it into a sprite and some sort of door entity where it slides to the side.


*hehe* You know, you could always make a sprite of a manhole cover, assign it to an Object entity, then assign it Click Speech. You could use the speech events to have it move back and forth. You could have the speech nodes contain things like "Creeeeek".

Hmmm. It has possiblities...

OTB
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Jimmyjay86
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 7:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

OTB said something????
Quote:
*hehe* You know, you could always make a sprite of a manhole cover, assign it to an Object entity, then assign it Click Speech. You could use the speech events to have it move back and forth. You could have the speech nodes contain things like "Creeeeek".

Hmmm. It has possiblities...



Mhmm, mhmm, und when did you ztart having zese deluzions??
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OnTheBounce
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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2002 10:57 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Jimmyjay86 wrote:
Mhmm, mhmm, und when did you ztart having zese deluzions??


I think it was shortly after I began delaying defacation to better savor it later.

But Freudian references aside, you don't think that this could be rigged up?

OTB
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