The pioneers are dead

[FlatL1ne]

put this in perspective , because you copy and quote where you want np.

as far as valve was concerned , I said quote they make great games,great story lines etc , you left that part of the post.

why did i use Valve ,because they modded long b4 they became the giant they are now.the point was they probably didn't sit around and bitch about what they didn't like they simply made it better.

I have a real life to ,mod is hobby for me.i would rather do it than sit here and argue the semantics

financially i was speaking in terms of Torrents not a failure of profit.
in general that for those who just take it ,use it and never purchase it.
do you honestly think that doesn't impact the price of your games?.

not sure where you were at when HL came out but i got a copy when it was released and it was $20 , i didn't get it at wally world in a bargain bin.
in fact that game still retains its value due to its popularity.

in no way did i say fix the game ,the subject here is Mod.
for some mod is yes fixing what they don't like about the game ,for others it taking the engine and coming up with a totally different concept.and b4 you quote this and say no shit ,I'm just stating that that's what I'm talking about here.there are parts of the game i was dissatisfied with and will fix for my own enjoyment and possibly post for those who felt the same way. they will get what they originally wanted or at least closer to what they expected at no cost.

you say you can write a great storyline ,great do that if that's all you have time for.why let your great story go to waste.you seem to have enough passion for Fallout the originals to do exactly that.i didn't ask you to make a mod all by yourself did i ?

I'm sure most of those people your referencing stealing a car they test drive also wind up in a bad place lol.

you say they didn't lose money.ill speak from a managerial standpoint then.
if those people went out and bought the game or any product lets say.
my profit margin would be higher , i would be able to offer future products with better quality to the consumer at a lower price because i would be able to pay a better wage to my employees ,bring in fresh new talent "we will use you as an example" to write a much better storyline.afford to invest much better technology or at least invest more in the old bringing it up to date. add more talented artists etc list goes on.
since they didn't now i cant afford to give the talented people i do have a nice raise keeping there moral at a high level to produce a quality product.
so there is a difference between test driving and stealing.

ill end this by saying if anyone here would indeed like to be a part of a mod i will contribute what i can.i do texture art in my spare time , i also photograph for textures.so feel free to make a request for either and i will do what i can.

[St. Toxic]

I hope he sticks around. Seems like a p. cool guy who don't afraid of anything.

i have had my share of torrents lol, back then they called it a BBS not an internet

And I'm sure you creamed your pants when you first gave that 14 k modem a righteous spin, and downloaded a broken rip of Faery Tale. As has been said, that doesn't actually reflect on the current peer to peer situation, where full releases are readily made available through the magic of broadband connections.

for a true torrent post you get a release of the final product and not a hacked version of it. I own the game but also had checked out a torrent of it and im here to tell there are differences. #1 most of the music has been ripped this is a key game element ,you cant get immersed in a game that lacks this ,the music or environment sounds are what draw you in

1# What's a "hacked" version? Is it your personal belief that some codemonkey jacked into a secure server through a payphone outlet, had and won a turnbased fight with a firewall, accessed the mainframe of Bethesda headquarters and escaped with the game a few bits short of the mark? THE FUTURE IS NOW!

What happened was, someone bought the game, made a complete copy of it on his machine and made those particular files available to the public. Then a group of coders circumvented the copy protection, most likely by removing the bits of code that verify wether or not a valid disc is inserted into the machine, and publically released that modified executable. There is absolutely no difference between a pirated copy of Fallout 3, or a legally purchased copy.

2# What happened to your second point? You wrote #1 and left it at that.

3# The music was shit. Either the player was enveloped in the "epic" classical music scores, reminding him of Oblivion, or the radio would cackle out a cheerful tune from the 20's 30's and 40's while he was blowing people's heads off, ala Stubbs the zombie. As a moodsetter, it walked the line between generic bullshit and pointlessly stupid camp. There's a good reason people were all too quick in replacing the music soundfiles with the Fallout 1 & 2 soundtrack.

4# Due to a porting or initial programming flaw, the (I'm assuming) EAX in Fallout 3 went haywire, and alot of sound effects are/were (don't know if the patch has corrected this) omitted (as in, silent) or appeared to be coming from the wrong directions in the virtual enviroment. That, I am sure, did not help in "immersing" players in the game.

the textures are what give the wow this cool and feels real

No, the believability of the gameworld is what gives the "wow this is cool and feels real". Consistence in plot, design and gameplay -- that's the key. The textures are there as a part of the 3d enviroment and matter only in that context.

hell yeah lol

Around here, lol is primarily used to attribute sarcasm to what is said. Just for future reference. I read that, and I see "Hell yeah; no wait, just shitting you."

Im here to get involved in making this a better game.

Pointless venture, and you're not the right man for the job.

things i dont like about the game.

the fact that they didn't do there homework on some of the weapons in the game and how they may be modified in the real world of FO3.
the Lincoln rifle for example. the rifle is a 1860 Henry , approx 400-700 where produced ,this one is special the etching is gold plated over brass ,it was textured to what brass would like after so many decades.the brass underneath given that was in a case all this time would be intact and would lack PATINA and gold ages differently ,they gave the stock or butt as you will a different wood also the barrel was made from Forged steel which ages differently ,given the age and usage etc . basically they went to the Smithsonian site to get the etching and to Henry to see an 1860 rifle however failed to look into the materials used to make this weapon and how they aged.i would have done the same thing had this just been reg rifle BUT ITS NOT lol.

I'm honestly stunned by the stupidity. Lets take a short break while I recuperate.

[Retlaw83]

put this in perspective , because you copy and quote where you want np.

I don't quote stuff I'm not responding to - I don't edit your posts to make it seem like you were saying something else. To do that is idiotic, because anyone with half a brain would be able to check your post. What Valve does and does not tend to has no bearing on this discussion.

why did i use Valve ,because they modded long b4 they became the giant they are now.the point was they probably didn't sit around and bitch about what they didn't like they simply made it better.

Why is that a point? I work 40 hours a week, and have hobbies, and friends and a bunch of other stuff to fill up my time. Fixing a defective product that I am in no way responsible for out of the good of my heart is not an efficient use of my time. "You should fix Fallout 3!" is in no way a valid argument to me saying it sucks. You know what else is readily modable and a lot of people own? Cars. But when there's a factory recall due to exploding engines, you don't see people replacing it themselves.

financially i was speaking in terms of Torrents not a failure of profit.
in general that for those who just take it ,use it and never purchase it.
do you honestly think that doesn't impact the price of your games?

It would effect the price of games if the game didn't turn a massive profit. Last I checked, the only major release to suffer from that is Spore, because it's copy protection was so restrictive that most of the people who bought it couldn't run it.

Since the torrent versions installed flawlessly, it's estimated as many or more people downloaded it than bought it. Which goes to show that accessibility - not quality - is the main factor in turning a profit these days.

in no way did i say fix the game

Except for the part where you told me (and I'm guessing the rest of us) to quit complaining about how Bethesda failed and fix the game for them, right?

you say you can write a great storyline ,great do that if that's all you have time for.why let your great story go to waste. you seem to have enough passion for Fallout the originals to do exactly that.i didn't ask you to make a mod all by yourself did i ?

Because I have my own things to write. Things that will hopefully help my career, and not glorified fan-fiction.

you say they didn't lose money.ill speak from a managerial standpoint then.
if those people went out and bought the game or any product lets say.
my profit margin would be higher , i would be able to offer future products with better quality to the consumer at a lower price because i would be able to pay a better wage to my employees ,bring in fresh new talent "we will use you as an example" to write a much better storyline.afford to invest much better technology or at least invest more in the old bringing it up to date. add more talented artists etc list goes on.
since they didn't now i cant afford to give the talented people i do have a nice raise keeping there moral at a high level to produce a quality product.
so there is a difference between test driving and stealing.

Except in this case, they lost a sale, not had something stolen. If I went to the Bethesda factory and stole a copy of the game - they actually get their money from retail outlets that buy copies - the people losing money would be the retail outlet.

If I download a torrent of a game, they haven't lost any sales, because I'm using the torrent to decide whether or not the game is worth buying. If it sucks, they won't receive a sale they don't deserve. If it's good, I'll go out and buy the game. Most people, myself included, do not have $50 to plunk down on something they don't know if they'll like or not.

[cazsim83]

for the last point you made - that's why I use the 7 day policy from GameStop (console games, though - I'd use steam or w/e if I used PC more) and if I don't like the game, I bring it back the next day, or the day after.

Who wants to throw fifty bucks at a game that fucking sucks? (Conan)

[FlatL1ne]

St. Toxic -I hope he sticks around. Seems like a p. cool guy who don't afraid of anything.

I'm not sure if that was meant as sarcasm or not to tell you truth after being
berated in this forum.
however if anyone is interested in working on a mod im game and will continue to come here.

as for torrents i agree with you ,but there are people who post torrents without some content also due to file size and or porting issues as you have stated.

maybe when i posted on game immersion i was speaking for myself and apologize.for me personally its everything in the game ,yet i lean towards the 3d world itself.a killer story line is great but when i get into a game
and all there is is blah textures and either no music or music that seems to have no place in the game at all i lose interest.in fact the first thing i do is look all around no matter how many times i get killed in the game and look at architecture ,textures ,the game models etc.for me that what makes me want to "see" more and of course the storyline keep me going forward.

the hell yeah lol comment ,i can see your point however that wasn't the intent i assure you.ill refrain from lol in the future as to not offend anyone when possable.

quote-I'm honestly stunned by the stupidity. Lets take a short break while I recuperate.
i was stating facts about that particular weapon in the game.In the real world im a Machinist and have knowledge on how certain materials react to weather.I also did research on the weapon itself.im not saying there wasn't any research done on this weapon ,its the Depth of research.I look for the most realism in a game also.if your going to put a weapon like that in the game at least make it as real as possable.dont just copy and paste it "Photo realistic" like they did.go to the henry rifle site and see for yourself .im assuming your referring to the i would have done the same thing comment.the artist may have had a time constraint who knows and maybe Bethesda didn't care and said just get it done.in that case i would have done the same thing.

curious ? you say I'm not the man for the job , why?


Retlaw83:
you have more than made your point.you don't want to be involved,great to each his own.
since I'm just some worthless piece of shit as far as your concerned ,i don't need an itinerary about what your goals in life are.
however i wish you " sincerely " the best in the field of your choice.

[Retlaw83]

Retlaw83:
you have more than made your point.you don't want to be involved,great to each his own.
since I'm just some worthless piece of shit as far as your concerned ,i don't need an itinerary about what your goals in life are.
however i wish you " sincerely " the best in the field of your choice.

I never once called you a worthless piece of shit. For the record you're an over-bearing, sycophantic hypocrit, but I wouldn't go so far as calling you a worthless piece of shit.

Now Rad Resistance, there's a worthless piece of shit for you.

[Caleb]

Blah blah blah.

There's that OH SHIT I HEAR THE ICE CREAM TRUCK!!!!!111!1111oneone talk we talked about.

You want to talk about fucking modding and hardcore communities? Look at the BLOOD community or those who have actually made an effort to mod for fallout. Fuck...even harris, as sad as it is, has more credibility when it comes to modding than adding a shiny glint to shit in a game. Sorry but changing the feel/pacing/mechanics/engine of a game is beyond the scope of most of what is available to the modding community. Bethesda was even inclined to not release modding tools for FO3. You mention valves rebuilding of an engine. Sorry but...maybe you don't know this but when you're given an engine to work with or you purchase rights to work with it, sure you may have the basic physics/rending structure but you're given a development SDK that allows you to alter not only the engine source but also to build up the executable source with which to run your game including physics, geometry, coding, etc. That isn't available to modders unless you want to reverse engineer it and probably get sued the shit out of. For this reason, much of what many would like to do to FO3 is just simply not possible. We might as well just go out and create a free form 2d engine with which to possibly build up a new FO game in the standard iso viewpoint with which to create a new game. <a href="http://www.fifengine.de">OH WAIT</a>.

Also..to ask...did you even read anything from the forum before posting here? I mean..seriously. It's almost impossible to accurately respond to all the shit you've posted here, it's just hard to comprehend that we're even having the same conversation. I've grown up on older games and to this day, most of the games I end up playing are fairly old. Also, what is your country of origin? Your grammar, spelling, and general sense of language is fucked in such a way that I'd be willing to believe you're a lowly tech support rep with a pirated copy of photoshop who can't texture for shit, believing that if you finally save enough money from the clinic for that VD you just can't quite get rid of you'll somehow be able to afford a retail copy that will cure your failure as an artist.

It seems like you can't realize the fact that, at the very least, bethesda ripped fans off with a shitty, non working product. Hell, did KoC ever even get his copy of FO3 to work? And the PS3 users are summarily fucked...DLC is quickly ruining games as developers are simply finishing a mediocre at best game, and quickly shoveling out addons as quickly as possible. It seems that since gaming became a profitable enterprise(halo), it's become quite gimmicky. I'm not saying that companies shouldn't make money, but, I'm quite wishing that these little trends could've simply stayed in the console market. PC gaming, for the most part, is dying. I for one can't even remember the last time I was genuinely excited for a game, though there have been several fan mods/indie games that have been at least decent if not quite good in the past several years. The issues with fallout 3 for the most part extend beyond it as an individual game and into the realm of gaming as a media of expression. A friend of mine constantly says that fallout 2 is one of the best examples of games as literature in the level of interaction and the depth of the story and consequences. There just simply hasn't been that kind of a game since. At times FPS's are getting a little more entertaining but at others it's hard to believe we've made much progress. Single player campaigns are normally shallow, boring, and far too easy. Or at best inconsistent and boring. Level design, while it might be shiny, is boring or uninventive. I miss cracking open a game and being in absolute shock and awe or surprise, level to level, at the transitions in theme, environment, etc. Sorry, but, for the most part it just doesn't happen anymore, and Fallout 3 epitomizes this for me. Hell, to me it even looked like shit.

[Dogmeatlives]

oh shit. Now thats a post!

[MadBill]

I miss the days when level design inspired "wow" reactions.
I think it started going downhill when I wow-ed myself out making my own levels in Shadow Warrior. Oh man the almost infinite vehicle possibilities of that game :don't mourn for me I am already dead:

[Caleb]

You want wash wang? or you want wang wash wang?

[FlatL1ne]

retlaw83

so in short your saying im a selfish prick who came here seeking glory at the expense of all you people.or your saying im trying to kiss your ass to get on your good side all the while being a hypocrite.or both


thats your opinion and you have every right to it.

maybe someday that stance will change .
however i doubt it and I'm not going to kiss ass to prove myself in this forum.

[Retlaw83]

retlaw83

so in short your saying im a selfish prick who came here seeking glory at the expense of all you people.or your saying im trying to kiss your ass to get on your good side all the while being a hypocrite.or both

The second one. And your ass-kissery is obvious with all your half-hearted back-pedalling.

[Wolfman Walt]

I dig how he completely ignored Caleb's post and just went for Retlaw.

[FlatL1ne]

however i wish you " sincerely " the best in the field of your choice.
because i said that ? because i had opinions that didn't agree with your and some that didn't necessarily disagree?

dude i don't wish for anyone to fail at any goal they set for themselves and i meant what i said.that's not kissing your ass , that's wishing you well.

you have never agreed and disagreed at the same time ?
look at your earlier posts then.
first Fallout 3 was a p.o.s
then you say the beginning in the vault was great.
then you say if third dlc turns this game around you may buy it.
"but you doubted it would"

isnt all that hypocritical ?
or did you simply take another look at the game and said hmm maybe it does have potential ?

do you look at both sides of the road or just the one that has the new asphalt on it ?

i agree and disagree on certain aspects of this game and torrents that doesn't make me a hypocrite ,it means i have opinions and i see both sides of the argument and maybe i even argue for both sides.

i never bashed you for dl a torrent ,i did and admitted so
I aimed at the people who keep it ,play it and don't buy it and how it may effect the industry and you and I as consumers.

i never disagreed with you about the storyline in FO3.
I merely stated that i found redeeming qualities in the game and was outright attacked for having that opinion.

i used valve and there dedication as an illustration, "OK maybe not a good one" you guys are intelligent enough to get what i meant and how that related to modding and how they improved another engine. yet again i was attacked about how it didn't relate to the subject at hand.
clearly it did relate ,it was saying hey these guys did it why cant someone else do it here with FO3.no im not saying make another HL ,it was just look at what the possibilities could be.

I did attack valves l4dead and then retract saying maybe ill try the game. i can see where that would be construed as hypocritical

[FlatL1ne]

I dig how he completely ignored Caleb's post and just went for Retlaw.

yes i overlooked him , its apparent he has problems with his penis
and wished he could jack off like myself and any other men.

he needs to confront his transsexual tendencies head on.
although you know him better than i do , what do you think ?

[Wolfman Walt]

what do you think ?

That you're not nearly as old as you claim to be.

[FlatL1ne]

ps .his post above that,sorry i thought you meant the others where he talks about j-off etc.

i cant argue with him on the game engine or the tools available and yes i did read here and other places about the fact that Bethesda wasnt going to release tools , i got here after they released tools though ,im not completely
familiar with them or how good they are or not.
as i stated when i came to this forum , I have never modded for this game or the engine.

i also agree with his assessment of DLC. i have live however didnt sign up for it until recently for the dlc microsoft is integrated and worthless it logs me into xbox live and not live for pc.no matter what i do.so i only get the dl then log out of that crap then restart the game.

[Stainless]

first Fallout 3 was a p.o.s
then you say the beginning in the vault was great.
then you say if third dlc turns this game around you may buy it.
"but you doubted it would"

How is that hypocritical? The start was decent, the third DLC might actually make the game interesting, but over-all the game was very sub-par in more ways then one. (ie; its a POS).

Hell, I thought Tranquility Lane was pretty cool, but still somewhat lacking. Doesn't mean I think the game is balls.

[Caleb]

...when did i ever talk about jerking off you fucking idiot? No recent post that I can remember, hell, my only other post in this thread was just as much a constructive criticism of what you said as that one.

[Dogmeatlives]

a selfish prick who came here seeking glory

Didn't we all start out that way at DAC?.... ah the memories