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Poll :: Which characters/enemies do you consider to be the most dangerous?

Fast guys with lotsa reaction time
8%
 8%  [ 2 ]
Big guys with big guns and a mean right hook
4%
 4%  [ 1 ]
Little guys in armor which have weapons that can pierce armor
29%
 29%  [ 7 ]
Big monsters with lotsa hitpoints and really big claws
37%
 37%  [ 9 ]
Characters with excellent combat AI, but not so great health or guns
20%
 20%  [ 5 ]
Total Votes : 24


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Sirgalahadwizard
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2002 9:33 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Another thing I havent seen in many games are amorphous blobs, "Acidic Jellies", etc.

I think alot of games would benefit from these kinds of characters because they're practicially invulnerable to bullets and if they're big, not only do they do a shitload of damage, they have a shitload of hitpoints too.

Hell, you could even make em subdivide into smaller jellies or spit little pieces of themselves at you.

I dont care which genre you put em in - fallout type games, first person shooters (alot harder - models and stuff), or strategy games (command and conquer had em though)... they're excellent characters to fight.

-----

A rapid-fire rocket launcher doesnt need multiple barrels, but it would need to be on the outside of the launching vehicle (on top or on the side of a tank for example). Rocket launchers have practically no recoil - the explosive blast out the back of the rocket usually goes harmlessly out the back side of the launcher.

You could have something like a belt-fed rocket launcher though :twisted:

Once one rocket is launched, just load another one in the tube - I suppose you could get an easy 3-5 rockets per second out of it without introducing overheating issues. I made one of these for another back-burner project a long time ago - a mini-missile launcher. Launched 15mm rockets in 5-shot bursts.

Hmm, reminds me of the devistator rockets from Duke Nukem 3D (had abit of an ammo shortage problem, but otherwise it was an awesome weapon).

-----

Haplo:
That was the Weapons Of Destruction mod for quake2. The streetsweeper was an alternate fire mode for the minigun which fired shotgun shells with about the same firepower as the plain ol' shotgun (inefficient compared to the super shotgun - less damage in two shots than a single shot with the super shotgun). And the machine-rocket-gun was just the machinegun (assault rifle) shooting out itty-bitty rockets which did 2x as much damage as normal machinegun bullets - that feature sucked imo.

As for me - I like plain ol' quake 2 gameplay - no mods - none of this grappling hook bullshit - no goddamn rocket arena... just plain quake2 (I do commend mods that effect the server capability of the engine though - as most of those dont directly influence gameplay).

Oh, and I still think they should ban the rocket launcher rather than the BFG... or people should at least start making maps without as many rocket packs, and actually have a BFG but with only one cell pack somewhere on the other side of the level (that way it gets to be like the redeemer from UT - a single blast and that's it... oh, I hate UT by the way).

I like it when the players have to duke it out without one-hit-kill weapons all the time - fighting with the machinegun or the shotgun or even hand grenades (omg im so good with those!) is abit of a challenge - 'cause it gets dirty real quick. Personally, I think that in most FPS games nowadays it's simply too easy to get killed/too easy to kill other players... they need to make tougher characters for these games (though im not an advocate of getting rid of one-hit-kill weapons alltogether though - just make em harder to maintain or aqquire).
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Megatron
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 1:09 am Reply with quoteBack to top

yeah, counter-strike pisses me off with the damage system. It's more or less a twitch game, if you see him first he will probably die. No skill required like strafing bullets, or retreating to get health back, just run around, headshot, wait 2 minutes restart.
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Haplo
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 1:14 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Yeah, I wasn't sure if it was MWP or WOD. SO I listed it as MWP because it's the one that I like to use (MWP, not WOD). All the extra weapons were alright, but I like the added power of the MWP mod. But I don't use them on DM, too unfair. 8)
Sirgalahadwizard
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 4:46 am Reply with quoteBack to top

A good recipe for a fun FPS computer game:
Make headshots do double damage only.

Make all multiplayer levels very large.

Armor should do a good job of protecting you from attacks - not only absorbing damage from hits but doing Damage Reduction and maybe even Damage Threshold as well (remember this from fallout?)

Subdivide weapons into five basic categories:
*Super Weapon - Kills you instantly, will hurt you severely if near it. Takes a long time to reload, is hard to hit stuff with directly (slow projectile, etc). Examples: BFG10k, Redeemer Missile, UT Rocket Launcher (w/multi-shot capability)

*Big Gun - Rocket Launcher/Railgun/Sniper Rifle/etc. Can do lethal damage (approximatly 100 point health loss) on impact. If it has either the ability to pierce through armor or generates a radial effect (rockets), then it should fire slowly (maybe 1 shot every 1.5 seconds). Examples: Q2 Rocket Launcher, Q2 Railgun, UT Sniper Rifle, UT Flak Cannon.

*Level 3 weapons - Powerful weapons capable of killing you quickly just thorugh blunt damage, but which have special circumstances surrounding them that make it harder to kill with them - such as a spin-up or spin-down time, or inaccurate attacks. Examples: Q2 Super Shotgun, Q2 Chaingun, Q3 Plasma Rifle, UT Bio Rifle (maybe level 2), UT Minigun.

*Level 2 weapons - Things that typically take 3 hits to kill you, 2 hits if weakened, instant death if you're limping around. For automatic weapons, consider each "hit" from above to be 4 successful impacts (it should take at least 10-15 shots to kill a full-health character). You can also stick weapons here that are a little more powerful so long as it's harder to hit an opponent with - timed grenades and assault rifles with projectiles (ie, hyperblaster) are examples. Examples: Q2 Shotgun, Q2 Machinegun, Q2 Hyperblaster, UT AMSD, UT Pulse Rifle, UT Ripper, UT Double Enforcers, Q2/Q3 Grenade Launcher, Q2 Hand Grenade

*Level 1 weapons - Crappy things that take a long time to kill you or are hard to hit you with. Good idea to start with these. Examples: Q2 Hand Blaster, Q3 Machinegun, Q3 Gauntlet, UT Impact Hammer, UT Enforcer, UT Chainsaw (thru mutator).

-----
Ammo for big guns should be restricted - perhaps only 5-10 small ammo packs should exist on a large level, only 2-4 for a small level. On really small levels, Big Guns take the stage as super weapons - should only have a single ammo pack for them and it should be stashed away from the gun.

Ammo for a super weapon should be almost nonexistant - a single charge/shot supplied with weapon and perhaps another shot for it stashed away on the other side of the level (which people will keep picking up before you get to it). Super weapons shouldn't be put into very small levels.

Ammo for level 1 and level 2 weapons should be all over the place, hell, might even provide a dispenser for level 1 weapons (or infinite ammo alltogether).

Make health more accessible.
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Megatron
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 5:55 am Reply with quoteBack to top

What I want to see weapon wise in a fps is:

Melee weapons:Knives, axes, katanas and chainsaws etc. You also should be able to throw objetcs at them like bins or tvs.

One handed guns:Pistols, uzis, sawn off shotgun and taser. Weakish but can do considerable damage if used correctly.

Double handed small guns(Rifles):shotguns, SMGs, rifles and stuff. Stronger than one handed guns but have a high recoil or are very un-accurate.

Big guns:Miniguns, napalm bomb launchers, LAWs, flame throwers. Devastating weapons that are usually easy to dodge or ammo is hard to find

Traps and thrown weapons:Throwing discs, trip-mines, remote controlled bombs and stuff.

One hit kill weapons:Kill you in one shot, but ammo is hard to come by and they have soem kind of trick to avoid.

I also think that the more you use certain kind of weapons you get soem kind of bonus. Like if you use the throwing disc and the katana, you can run faster and jump higher (ninja) ehile if you use the minigun a lot you have more armour and weapons do more damage (walking tank)

I like on games when people set up traps or remote sentrys and stuff. makes it more intresting.

And they have games where you go and shoot lots of shit, and games where you sneak around...Why not a game where you have to talk your way out of a situation or be a hacker or something?
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TheReaper
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 6:03 am Reply with quoteBack to top

The UT Impact Hammer was a one-shot kill weapon, you just had to charge it up and touch someone with it and they die.
Slave_Master
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 9:35 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Pyro, there was hacking game released recently. Don't remember the name of it, but it was somewhat good, according to the reviews.

What I would like to see in a game is where you have distinct weapons, set up somewhat like Pyro has, but you can pick up about anything and beat the hell out of something with it. Or maybe have an inventory and you can have so many weapons in one weapon type slot. So you could pick up a chair and throw it at someone, and you don't have it any more. Not exactly too sure, might be hard to implement as well. I would like to see something like that in a game though.
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Sirgalahadwizard
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 11:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

TheReaper:
The UT Impact Hammer may have been a one hit kill weapon, but you had to get in melee range with out them ripping you a new ass first - if you could even hit them in the first place. And the fact that you have to charge it up first both make it unwieldy - which dumps it down into the 1st level weapons category (yet, at the upper end...). I'd rather be using an enforcer than the impact hammer.

God I hate Unreal Tournament - give any number of reasons why it's any better than any other FPS game...

-----

I wanna see good weight and size management in a FPS game. Like a carrying limit - so you can carry around 4 rifle-type guns and 200 bullets and 50 shotgun shells, or 2 big guns and 500 bullets and 25 rockets, etc. Nothing too realistic, just make it slow you down a little bit if you really are carrying everything and the weed sink... maybe make reloading and changing weapons a little slower, maybe make it harder to jump, etc.
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Bulldog
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 1:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

What we need is another Q2 railgun, a railgun that actually does damage instead of a damn pea shooter that'll get you killed. Railgun duels in Rocket Arena 2 were the height of Q2, IMHO.
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TheReaper
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2002 7:05 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

The so called "Railgun" In jedi knight was the most unrealistic railgun there is, instead of fireing a slug at high speeds that will go through most things, it fires a pack of explosives instead, that says to me: ROCKET LAUNCHER.

I agree about the impact hammer, it is a rubbish weapon but I hate it when all the bots are good with it and kill you all the time, that pisses me off.

Maybe a system like Deus Ex had then? A limited inventory space and you slowed down when holding heavy weapons and reloading was slow until you got good at the weapon catagory. Then again, it is a little strange in that manner... say you spend all your time with a shotgun and have learned to reload it in the quickest way possible. In Deus Ex, you could pick up an assault rifle and be as good with that as you were with a shotgun. But what I think it should be is there are different catagories for each weapon, shotguns, automatic shotguns, average pistols, exotic pistols. It may give you a lot more skills to master but it makes the game more believeable
tux
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2002 6:49 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Wait, wasn't that called a RL in JK? I don't know, I played the russian version.
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TheReaper
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2002 5:06 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

No, I just played it again to be sure and it is called a railgun, who thought that a railgun did that has less brains than george bush.
Sirgalahadwizard
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 10:26 am Reply with quoteBack to top

Any weapon that shoots anything in single-shot or semi-automatic fasion ought to use that skill for those kind of attacks - even energy weapons. However, fully automatic weapons have to be handled differently - even if they're mounted. Sure, some weapons are harder to handle than others - a 9mm beretta and a .50cal Desert Eagle (or insert 10mm pistol and 14mm Pistol if you're referencing fallout) are handled differently... but when it's all said and done, when you pull the trigger the bullet goes where you pointed the gun and your accuracy is not effected (not significantly anyway) by the weapon's recoil like it is with machineguns. Though maybe for more heavier weapons - like a .50cal desert eagle, or a minigun, there should be a weapon handling penalty you suffer from until you get a perk to negate it - since they're hard to handle and exotic variants of the semi-auto and full-auto categories.

Energy weapons are just either a semi-auto or full-auto weapon which has a weapon handling penalty (since shooting a laser beam gives off no recoil, and plasma shoots a slow projectile). If you learn how to handle the energy weapons technology associated with the weapon (lasers, plasma, pulse, disrupter, etc), you dont get the penalty anymore.

I got pretty damn good at the railgun in Q2, but I never got any good with the rocket launcher, and I was uber-fucking master of the BFG (whenever I shot it, I really did kill everyone in the room, and I came outta fucking nowhere so nobody saw it coming).

Yes, railguns are like a glorified sniper rifle - which you dont really need to score a critical with to kill the opponent (it does so much damage - get hit in the arm and you lose it, leg hit = lose a leg, etc). And they're built to penetrate armor in the first place so any person with brains can recognise that armor shouldn't effect it very much.
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Bulldog
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 1:02 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Sirgalahadwizard wrote:
Yes, railguns are like a glorified sniper rifle - which you dont really need to score a critical with to kill the opponent (it does so much damage - get hit in the arm and you lose it, leg hit = lose a leg, etc). And they're built to penetrate armor in the first place so any person with brains can recognise that armor shouldn't effect it very much.


I consider the railgun more of a close quarters battle "sniper rifle", if you will, going on Q2 if you could run and jump with it (these aren't normal people, remember) it has a fast enough ROF that someone with skill could take out 3 enemies with shotguns. It'd still have a reduced effectiveness in a long range open field type situation, but you'd have the option of playing both sniper and assault roles in isolated/small scale situations.
It's be the perfect "one man army" weapon.
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VasikkA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 4:31 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Is it just me or is there any similarities between railgun and gauss rifle? They seem awfully close to each other, technically. If i'd have to choose between the two I'd take the gauss rifle.
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Sirgalahadwizard
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 8:04 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I always tended to use the railgun at long range and hit people jumping off of ledges and getting out of the water (I learned to predict their movement through the air - thanks to Q3's space void levels). I never camped much with the railgun - If I did camp, it was usually with something like hand grenades or the chaingun or the bfg (I also became a master of using the hand grenade - like a depth charge I made it blow up where I wanted it to). Half of the strategy with using a railgun is learning how to dodge it - nothing I hate more than getting into a dogfight with someone else using a railgun and having to do the macarena twist and twirl until someone gets hit by accident.

I also used the railgun alot in close quarters going around corners... people always used to wonder if I was cheating with the "see thru walls" cheat, hell I never ever cheated (unless you consider doing FOV changes cheating)... I just had helluva reaction time (but not perfect accuracy). Someone comes around a corner, bam-splat outta nowhere.

I also did some spawn-camping, esp the frag pipe, tho I usually didnt survive long at it and it only served to help me keep up with the gaming gurus (those greasy fuckers who get cheap kills with the rocket launcher).

I'd have to say my worst level from the original Q2DM# series was either the frag pipe or the warehouse (Frag pipe = too many casualties from rockets, too many lava-assisted suicides... Warehouse = power shield, nuff said).

Lost halls and Lava Tomb are by far my best ones though (lost halls = a big level with a nice arrangement and arsenal... lava tomb = the same thing, but a little more dangerous cause of the lava, so only occasionally I dont do well at all).

-----

Gauss Rifle and Railgun are the same thing, the names are interchangable. They both use magnetic forces to shoot a bullet at really high speeds. Though the railgun from quake2 used an exceptionally larger projectile than the gauss rifle from the fallout series...

(looked like at least 20mm shells for the Q2 railgun, but then again they coulda just made the clip bigger so you could get ahold of it easier - it looks like it also has 18 shots in it too, but it only gives you 10).
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BigJack
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 8:07 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Actually the gauss rifle is a railgun... Ever played Red Faction? It has a rail gun the only gun that pierces walls.

Gauss and rail guns use the same technology, projectiles fired at insanely high speed using electricity, wicked 8O .
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Haplo
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 8:12 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Actually, bullets fired at speeds approaching the speed of light, using super-powerful electromagnets. Close though.

What I would give to see the Phalanx on a battle ship fire... an industrial sized minigun...
VasikkA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 8:45 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I searched on google and found that actually some functional rail guns have been made, though they're only prototypes it would be nice to see one in military use soon. They would be quite expensive to manufacture I assume.
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Slave_Master
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2002 10:26 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Yeah, and IIRC, they use a lot of power too. A railgun would be damn nice though.
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